We get started, I guess if you're ready,
I am. Um, first
of all, thank you
for taking some time today, Mike.
Um, I think I've been kind of jelling on this
for a while, obviously.
Um, I ask you a lot of questions, uh, in a variety
of different contexts, and so I was hoping to, uh,
string a bunch of them together
and, um, build a little bit more of a clear picture about
what your spiritual journey has been like
and kind of how you've gotten to the place
that you are today.
So, I know a little bit about it,
but I'd like to, to kind of dive in.
So some of this, um, I may be hearing again,
but, um, there might be some more details
and things that you can drive into a little bit.
So I do, um, go ahead
and correct me if I'm wrong, I know
that you have a little bit of, um, uh,
religion in your upbringing,
but that also your, um, encounter with, um,
ufology, uh, also played a role in kind of how you, uh,
unfolded into your spiritual path.
So can you, um, tell me a little bit, um, first about the,
the upbringing and, and kind of what impact, um,
that had on you as you, um, headed into adulthood?
Yeah, I suppose a lot of my childhood was
probably an echo of, of previous things
and just trying to get my bearings on
many different distortions.
And I feel like my spiritual path did not develop strongly
in my teenage years, except for,
I guess on a personal level, just personal lessons.
I feel like that's a large part of our spiritual journey is
just the personal lessons more so than the spiritual studies
or what we perceive as spiritual studies necessarily.
I certainly read the Bible,
read the New Testament when I was a kid,
and that was part of our, you know, our church upbringing
with the Assemblies of God church.
They had me in a program called Royal Rangers, which was
very, it was, it's a bit like Boy Scouts
and it's like, it, that taught me a lot of life skills
and a little bit more discipline, I guess,
with reading the Bible.
But that was a small, small part of my life.
And it was like, the,
the bigger part was maybe in my teenage years listening
to pastors with a lot of different philosophies about the,
the value of spiritual texts and the Bible especially.
And, but I, I ended up turning, I would say,
somewhat into a narcissist in the sense of overconfidence,
in the fundamentalist way of perceiving things.
And it was almost like that that narcissism sort
of spring loaded me to question, how did I end up here?
You know? And, and so the, the humility that came
with the discovery of the ufology subject was,
was the biggest factor on my spiritual growth, I think.
'cause I recognized that I did not know what I did not know,
and I was assuming that I could know everything I needed
to know from
what people had already written about the Bible.
And that was very little having to do with, you know,
recent, uh, testimonies from people
who are in the government and military
experiencing these strange things.
And that's just, it's just obviously overlaid in some kind
of way with the angels and the demons of the Bible
and the, the, just the, the weird aspects of the past
that get recorded that,
that aren't fitting into nice boxes yet.
And so there's just endless mystery
and endless puzzles that,
that nothing had prepared me for, for that.
And also the fact that when you,
at least back in 2006 when I felt like I started to wake up
to what,
when I basically discovered the disclosure project Steven
Greer's, uh, project to, uh, get a lot
of different witnesses to testify together, that
that opened me up to the possibility that I had
to do a ton more research on my own
and not just trust what anyone was saying.
So it was the, the, the fact that I had to
throw everything out to, to get deeper to the truth.
It also led to some conflicts with
the people in my life that led me to believe that, um,
I, I can't just be arrogant in my beliefs at all anymore.
I have to be humble to actually get, get anywhere
with, with helping people.
Um, so, so that, that led to many, many layers
of breaking down walls and barriers.
And that, you know, eventually when I, um,
first tried to, well, there was an experience I had in 2012,
which was basically the age of like 2028, um,
I, I 27, yeah.
I basically finally broke down
and built a large pyramid with the help of my dad.
I built a pyramid, and once I had a pyramid constructed
for meditation, I, I decided to use my Bitcoin
and try some large Joseph LSD.
And that was, that was a huge breakthrough for me also to
completely, uh, I had
what would be called an eco death experience,
and that that kind of tore away my assumptions,
my assumptions of separated identity.
Uh, it's hard to put into words what that is like,
but it's like there's no more sense of me in the sense
that I had come to know me,
and it's like, I'm more like a wave on an ocean.
And so all the arrogance
and narcissism just kind of is like embarrassing side note
to the recognition of the deeper truth of the, the,
the mind body, spirit energies,
which are floating w within a sea of consciousness, which,
you know, I, I could call any part of it myself,
but the, the, the ssociation of the nature of identity is,
seems to be a more, more central part of the journey
that psychedelics certainly seem to help with that, um,
redevelopment of the, the capacity
to perceive into the subconscious structures where our sense
of self is coming from our sense of identity.
And ultimately,
what I feel has been valuable is the recognition that the
ssociation with the sense of self, the sense of identity,
when you have a solid religious footing for that,
it can be a much easier process to say,
I'm no longer identified with the, the,
the separate self, the, the old self, the, the flesh.
I'm identified with the infinite spirit.
I'm identified with Christ identified as Christ.
And that, that kind of allows me to
pull back up all the roots from the teachings
of Christianity and kind of leverage those two, just,
just work on becoming like Jesus.
And that just, it,
it no longer means just trying to emulate him.
It, it means, you know, allow my identity
to be subsumed in him.
Yeah, a hundred percent. Well, you've,
you definitely touched on, um, a few different things that,
uh, we're gonna dive into a little bit, um, further.
But as we're still, um, on the
ufology, um, kind of the, uh,
origin aspect of, um, when you started to kind of open up
to a, a wider world of, of possibilities, um,
tell me about the first time that you saw
a UFO the first time that you were absolutely certain that
what you just saw was, um, definitely, um, A UFO by,
I'll say any classification, whether it would be manmade
or extraterrestrial in, in origin,
but that you saw a craft that you knew was, was doing things
that, um, are otherwise not possible.
Well, I, I, I'll, I can share this story,
but it feels a little bit like skipping ahead
because of the experiences I had with Stephen Greer's, uh,
training group, which were,
Well, let's start with those, if those,
if those lay good groundwork, let's start with those. Yeah,
Yeah. So,
yeah, when, and basically when I first started doing
heavy research, and I discovered Steven Greer had this group
that was going out and, you know, he charged less money,
but then going out to different locations
where were considered UFO hotspots
and doing training, which would be bas basically meditation
and guided meditations and attempts at remote viewing.
But I, uh,
the most profound experience I had there was the event when
some people, it was sitting in a circle,
maybe 30 people in a circle out in
Joshua Tree National Park.
Um, after having done several meditations,
there was one point at which people sitting on the opposite
side of the circle for me said that
they were hearing a strange noise out in the field,
and, um, wondering who else could hear that.
And it seemed as though only a
small number of people could hear it.
And it was, it was a strange thing that they were insisting
that there was this sound out there.
And then it, it started visiting other people.
The sound started visiting other
people in the circle, seemingly.
And when it finally got to me, I didn't say anything,
and no one else said anything.
No one said, I hear that too. I hear that.
So that was, that was very eerie.
It was as though the, the sound was projected, like a laser
or something into certain people's ears.
And, you know, my mind was racing, of course,
how could that possibly be?
But at some point, it,
it is almost like my mind was calmed down
and I realized this is just an extremely highly advanced
intelligence that is interacting with people in the ways
that they're ready at the timing that they're ready.
And that, that, that continued
through many different experiences, recognizing
that whatever this thing was, it was,
it was very cautious in how it was approaching people
and giving people just enough so that they're not afraid
and just enough to become aware
that they're, that they're real.
Because that's, that's a huge problem I think
for these groups that contact people,
that people's egos can get in the way.
And there's all kinds of attachments
and distortions that result from the experience itself
that can be unintended consequences.
Even if the original experience
that the person has in the short term is a very inspiring
or uplifting kind of experience.
It can be unattended side effects of the long term.
So, so that, that, that to me was very eerie,
but it, it, it felt like I was connected
to something and they were watching my thoughts.
And there were many other experiences, um,
gradually over time that, that built up that,
that made me realize that I'm, I'm sort
of in a telepathic exchange, which, which culminated
with some of my first, obviously this is a,
a ship experiences,
which was several months in the later maybe four
or five months in the, maybe three
or five months in the future, I was
meditating alone in a park in, uh,
southern ca Southern California, um, called
Mason Park just in inside of Irvine, California.
And that, um, it was intentional meditation around midnight,
um, just late in the evening after I, pretty much,
after I graduated from college,
I just didn't have any job yet.
I decided to spend a lot of time, I was trying to figure out
what to do with my life, really.
Um, 'cause I thought I wanted to make video games,
and then I had to question a lot of things.
And I spent a lot of time meditating in the park.
And, um, I think the most strong,
um, experiences that I, I suspect
that I saw what I would call shooting stars, uh,
before I said, oh gosh, that's them.
Um, because of 1, 1, 1, 1, um,
one experience in particular I remember was
like, they were talking to me in my head
and they were, they were talking with words, like responding
to my thoughts and saying, Mike, we love you, Mike.
It's okay. And,
and it was as though there was this attempt
to calm my mind down and open me up to love.
And, and there was some experience of,
of great love of forgiveness.
Um, and this is, this happened at different times,
so I'm kind of mixing 'em together,
but there were different experiences where I brought,
was brought to a state of forgiveness,
and then a very, very bright flash, um, appeared in the sky,
right, uh, right where I was looking.
And, and then, and then I had to actually stop
and question, wait a minute, is that them?
So, so it was that first question is that them,
and then they, then they, they appear again when they,
when they wanna confirm that kind of thing.
And, um, so there were several experiences like that.
There was one experience I had
where it was actually literally, I was thinking about Jesus,
and I was like on the, like, on the fence, like, so
what is the deal with this, this giant mechanism of,
of religion that we're dealing with Chris with Christianity?
Should I put any work into that at all?
And, um, into pursuing that.
But when I was thinking specifically about
Jesus, what do you guys think about Jesus?
Then they, it was like just this fireworks,
um, kind of show.
And then they said, I mean, it was, it was all white lights.
It wasn't colored lights,
but it was, it was like they were trying to overwhelm me
with love at that moment saying like,
you have no idea how much we love Jesus.
You have no idea. And fans So beyond, yeah.
Yeah. So that was very meaningful to me. Um, beautiful.
Um, and when was the last time
you encountered what you were certain was a UFO,
and what was that encounter like?
Well, at the UFO Watchtower where you were present?
Um, was this just two weeks ago now?
Um, yeah, so after I,
after we did the meditation, um,
I remember being sitting in a chair
and Paul was talking about
a potential place we could do.
Um, of course we had many experiences that night,
but the one that stood out, stood out
to me the most was when Paul was talking about the potential
location we could do the next one.
And then I was the only one who saw right flash, I think.
No, no, no. There was one
or two other people said they saw it.
Yeah. Directly above.
Was this the one directly above?
Yeah, I actually saw that one too.
And that was actually probably among the very first ones
that I've seen actually, that I would say, yeah,
that actually exhibited behavior that I cannot
otherwise explain as a plane
or a satellite, which is actually pretty easy.
Or, or an asteroid or something like that.
It's pretty easy to explain most things in the night sky,
and most of the times I've gone out.
That's what I've seen. But this, um,
this behaved a little differently.
Why don't you, uh, describe it?
Um, well, I mean, it, it was literally just a, a white
ball that appeared for a split second
and disappeared and no movement to it, from what I remember.
And it was brighter than any star in the sky,
and it seemed like there were clouds there,
there was no other stars around it.
So it seemed like it was,
it's not like the clouds were moving,
it was brighter than anything
that would've been behind the clouds.
That was my memory of it.
I think I saw, I might might have saw a different one then
because it was moving,
but it had sort of appeared kind of mid sky, really.
And that could have materialized from coming from
behind clouds that are maybe darker or harder to see,
but it was moving, um, in a straight line.
Um, and then it, it did a power up, like it got,
it flashed a real bright,
brilliant white light just one time.
Oh, yeah. And, and then faded back to kind of what it was,
and then it faded out of the sky.
And so that one single flashes,
unless you're getting glinting, which you know,
can happen obviously over on, um,
the other horizon at just the right time.
But, um, I don't think this is anywhere near there,
because this was much later at night
and it was directly overhead. Yeah.
And it's free will preserving that.
They can, people can dismiss it
as their iridium flares and that kind of thing.
It's,
It's Interesting Indeed.
It show just
enough right. To Yeah.
It be whatever you decide that it's, yep. Um, okay.
Um, if you had to guess, uh,
what do you think open contact will look like?
And, uh, I mean specifically, I suppose, uh, one, presuming
that you do think that it's going to happen
and perhaps in our lifetimes, I'm not sure if you're, um,
probably familiar with, um, some of bihar's uh, predictions
around timelines, I think, in the next few years.
Um, but what I'd really like to know is whether you think
that, um, the impact on humanity would be
more readily apparent in a kind of spiritual
and vibratory fashion, um, in sort of the knowledge, um,
sort of how this opened you up, for example, earlier on.
Um, do you think that, that that's what sort
of the more immediate impact would be?
Or do you think that it would be more of a,
a technological impact
and that the, the impact on sort of, you know,
humanity's collective consciousness would
take, um, more time?
This is huge, huge question with many,
many threads to it.
And, um, I, I'm, I'm influenced by, by
what people have predicted about the future, Corey.
Good, especially, um, the law of one to a degree, the law
of one books have very, very small hints at, at the nature
of, of what's what is likely impossible.
And they actually hint that the,
the negative groups are more likely to want us
to be seeing things to become afraid
and be more easily manipulated.
And to some degree, we are already in a, in a consciousness,
uh, mass consciousness state where, uh, a very large portion
of, uh, religious groups will automatically interpret
anything as being tricks, as being deceptive, and
therefore must be the demons.
And so it's, it's extremely precarious situation to
open us up to mass contact at this particular point in time
when people are not ready to even work together on,
on talking about what these things could be rationally.
You know, it's, it's just, there's so much fear
around it that, that gets in the way.
Would your presumption then be
that if open contact did happen in the next few years,
that it would be by a negatively polarized entity
because of that fact that we're, we're unprepared?
Well, it depends what you mean by open contact,
but, um, I think it's gonna be,
but the law of one also does talk about the fact
that there are the positive groups that are kind of trying
to co counterbalance every negative experience that is
that the quarantine has not been properly adhered
to in those cases when, when there is an overabundance
of negative contact without the positive influences.
So it's like an open doorway invitation for positive groups
to come in and, and help correct things.
And I think that that might even happen in cases
of abductions for people.
Um, there might be two different types of beings abducting
to, to do two different types of work.
Um, but this is just so speculative.
I, you know, I'm, I'm still hidden behind, lost
behind the Veil is you are on some level.
Sure. But I think what you, you know, sort of
how you opened up probably reflects
what you're thinking on this is, which is
that there's gonna be a lot of, um, if it were
to happen soon, there would be a lot of resistance to it.
Yeah. And, um, and
therefore the impact such as it could be even gleaned
to be positive, would almost certainly have
to be technological if it's gonna take the rest of,
you know, so society's a long time to kind of catch up with,
uh, and accept this.
But, um, in terms of what it means
or how it's, uh, how it's interpreted, I don't know.
I mean, open contact as I sort of understand it,
or certainly as I refer to it, just means that it's,
it's absolutely undeniable contact.
Like it's, you know, it's pervasive
and it's, um, fully evident with lots
and lots of millions of eyewitnesses, et cetera, um, to
where you just, you can't really deny it anymore.
Not to say that people wouldn't,
but that the, that the mental fortitude that it would take
to be, you know, in continuous denial of that,
I think would narrow the number of people down further
and further, you know?
Right. Who could actually achieve that
and eventually have to just sort of accept it.
Yeah. I think this is happening more gradually than
that actually, with people like David Grosch coming forward
and the, the upcoming year
or two, we'll see a lot of people turning into believers
just from the data
that's coming out about what's already showed up.
It doesn't have to be a particular event.
It could be gradual, I think,
because we've had so many events already.
But I think that cer certainly it's possible
that there could be an open contact scenario where groups
who are ready to see it in a very positive light,
who are ready to be ambassadors, they may be able
to receive, um, when, when there's a collective calling,
that there is definitely a need, um, for
a greater degree of contact.
And there is some, um, probably controversy in how
to interpret the law of one books when they talk about the,
the allowance of the breaking of quarantine.
But there really is no inherent, uh, limitation when,
when they, when they say certain groups can propose an idea
of contact before the Council of Saturn.
And then when they have that, that idea approved,
then they're able to come and do some kind of experiment.
And so if there are groups who are specifically ready to be
on the forefront of helping to structure society around
spiritual principles where there's not a desire for control
and power to manipulate others where there's clearly desire
to simply educate and help others, I feel like there's an,
there's an alignment with where positive groups might have a
doorway there to be
of greater service without disrupting the free will
and mass consciousness too, too much that way.
Lemme ask you, um, this is sort of a related
but side question, because it does have to do with this sort
of, uh, karmic, you know, balance and,
and, um, positive and negative polarity.
Um, and Steven Greer actually, um,
when we talk about, um, the reverse engineered technologies,
obviously his latest documentary the Last Century is, um,
kind of bifurcated and it's about, um, both, uh,
free energy and gravity control.
And so I have this sort of,
and I, I always love the the thought experiment type things
that, that we get into.
'cause you, you have a way of seeing these things, um,
and helping me see them in a way
that makes maybe a little bit more sense.
And so I have this, um, you know,
this real dilemma I suppose we're trying
to understand the nature of, of, um,
our galactic kind of neighborhood and,
and the influences of information
that have been allowed to flow in.
And yet, um, not to anyone
that would open source the information
and kind of have this sort of like, I want to ask some of,
you know, these, uh, these beings almost like, um,
Reuben Langdon from, you know, interview with Ed.
Like, he is got a whole show
that's all he does is go and interview.
And it's like, I'm just dying to know why is it that these,
that the seed information
for these technologies keeps being fed into people,
you know, that are in the inventor class,
and the I'm gonna be the next trillionaire class,
and they're not handed to anyone that's just, you know,
ready to just openly publish 'em to the world.
Um, that just seems really weird to me, right?
Because as you described these,
the opportunities ought to be balanced.
And, and, you know,
this technology clearly has been within our grasp,
our collective grasp for a while,
and yet we're, as the masses still unable to, to have it.
And it seems like this would be a very easy thing
to deliver, given that it can be delivered telepathically to
any one of probably millions of people who would, you know,
instantly publish it and post it.
So why are we still looking for this information?
Well, I think that a lot of it has been published
and posted, and it gets taken down,
and I think I've seen some of it.
And, but I also think that Nicola Tesla is an example
of somebody who was supposed to go down that road.
He was one of the most, um, angelic,
they said people in the law of one, that he was ready to be
of service to others to a great extent.
And yet he still was able to be, uh, manipulated or,
or twisted in his thinking, in his, the way
that he was perceiving others who
were probably not being very nice to him.
And he probably thought that they were not ready for it,
or that they wouldn't publish it widely.
And, you know, possibly he, he was coming into the period
of time where the information couldn't have been suppressed
as easily and as it, as it had suppressed today, where it's,
you know, it's possible that there are actually
satellites they can detect when certain kinds
of technology is fired up.
And then that, that allows them to say, this is classified.
We have to either buy this out,
or we have to put a stop to this in some way.
And it's possible that there are many mechanisms that keep,
um, because really there's a lot
of very powerful interests trying to control the, the power,
the sources of great power are things that can disrupt
governments, militaries.
So those sources of power have to be managed by the sources
of power, which are trying to maintain their control.
And I think that's, that's the dilemma right now.
Um, it's not necessarily
that the information is not available, it's that the,
the delivery of the information is still very tricky.
And, you know, the internet can do a lot,
but, um, so I'm, I, I haven't given up hope
that this is a, there's a possibility
that this could happen, uh, any day, uh,
where something just goes so viral, so fast under the radar,
um, that, that it makes it out.
And yeah, I, I have hope that this could still happen,
and it's, but I think that everyone is capable of being
deceived, uh, basically their own,
their own temptations to, to want more money or power
or fame is still, is still always there.
You can never completely eradicate it. Um,
Probably doesn't help. There's
so many hoaxes out there as well.
I mean, if you go to YouTube
and search free energy, you can just literally find hundreds
of videos that purport to show exactly that.
And yet, um, yeah.
How do you, how do you tell one from the other?
Well, um, Steven Greer certainly implores his audience in
that documentary to, uh,
to bring these things directly to him.
And he'd be happy to have 'em tested in, you know, labs
and, uh, actually they're building, uh,
a lab to do exactly that.
I think, um, mm-Hmm.
And, and that he is got, I think he said it would be 24 7
live streamed of everything that they're doing at all times.
So it would just always be transparent.
Kind of a neat idea. Yeah.
Yeah. Um, all right.
Before we move, um,
on a little bit further into the trajectory here, uh,
if you could ask an et anything, uh, first of all, what,
what type of et would it be and what would you ask?
Wow, that's, that's challenging.
I think we know what I would ask, I would ask
for free energy and gravity control.
Yeah. Clearly.
Yeah. I mean, it, it is like, what, what information
is most lacking in the public consciousness right now
that would be of most service?
And like, how can I deliver that?
It's like, yeah, I do feel like that's related
to my life's purpose, is just figuring out how
to deliver the information that is most needed.
It hasn't been said yet, or properly said or said enough.
And on some level, it's like we're doing it
with the art discussion of the major arcana even.
It's like, it's like there's just layers of the onion
and the, the deepest layers are comprehending the,
the patterns of intelligent energy, intelligent affinity
that have chosen to manifest.
And just coming back to the roots
of why is everything the way that it is can help us process
and piece everything together, I think,
in a more coherent light.
So rather than have a,
or pose a one specific burning question for you
as an individual, uh, you might say, Hey,
what's the most important message I could,
I could deliver back to everyone else?
Right. Love that. Okay.
Well, that's a great segue into, uh,
the broader spiritual teaching.
So we know that you had, uh, a relatively, um,
Christian sort of childhood,
but that was maybe typical of, of most in that, um,
it was church and that sort of thing,
but it didn't seem like it, you know, totally struck you
until you got into maybe some more
of the philosophy of it in your teen years.
And then you encountered, um, ufology that seemed
to kinda have you, uh, rethinking everything
that you thought you knew before.
So, um, how did you then embark on
what you were going to then go explore?
So obviously you started exploring disclosure
and kind of what evidence there was and all the things,
but then as you start to put your spiritual, you know,
chaps back on here and,
and venture out, what does that look like?
Where did you start?
Well, I had learned in college
that BitTorrent was the best way to share large amounts
of data, large amounts of information.
So I found a, a website
that was called conspiracy central.org,
and it's now, it's called Content.
It's shortened down to C-O-N-C-E n.org.
And they were sharing, uh,
it is probably more popular back in the day before YouTube.
This was like before YouTube. You could,
and there was a period of time where Google Video,
it was a service that, where people were just uploading full
length documentaries without being censored.
And that was a huge way to get a lot
of information out for people.
But, uh,
before then, uh, torrents were a very, very useful way.
And so I was downloading like every single thing
that I could find that I had never heard
of from that website.
And that included people's archives of books
that would be many gigabytes worth of scanned PDFs of books,
and many documentaries.
Many, many just strange things
that people thought would were, was useful to know.
It wasn't like conspiracy related necessarily.
Sometimes it was strictly spiritual.
Um, sometimes it was health related and,
but e eventually that led
to things like discovering Project Camelot
and Project Camelot had an interview with David Wilcock
and David Wilcock was talking about the Law of One.
And, um,
I guess at some point I also found out about a Course in
Miracles pretty early on through a person named
Chuck Anderson, who goes by Master Teacher,
master Teacher, of course, in Miracles.
Very interesting to listen to.
First, which one did you, which one did you find first,
the Law of One or the Course of Miracles? A
Course in Miracles I found first.
Okay. Um, but I didn't take it seriously, uh,
until a few years later.
I didn't seriously start doing the workbook, um,
until about the same time I started taking the law
of One seriously too, which should have been closer to 2008.
This was 2006 when I started my research journey
Outta curiosity, was that out of, um, some sense of,
of distance that you had put between you
and kind of your Christian roots,
and that the course kind of has a Christian, you know, core
to it, or you were just putting kind of everything
in the middle pile, you know, as you discerned exactly
what it was that was gonna resonate in the long run?
Yeah, there wasn't any strong pull to, to one thing up
until, um, I found the Law of One.
Um, but it, the, the Course of Miracles just kind
of like a giant question mark.
It's like, what the heck is this?
'cause it was such an unusual kind of writing,
and I didn't even put the pieces together
that this was claimed to be the writings of Jesus
or the Channel links from Jesus.
Um, it, it, it, it was just like I was mesmerized
by this particular teacher of the material.
Um, but I was also discovering Agar Casey's materially
around then and Agar Casey.
Uh, there was a, a CHM file, uh, that I found on a, a
file sharing service, which had the
KC ratings in a more digestible format
that I could just plow through.
And that was the best transition material for me to, um,
take Christian thinking
and reinterpret many verses to what made way more sense.
And Agar Casey was a master
of interpreting scripture in ways
that made the most beautiful sense that,
that I've ever seen.
And the, the the, in this particular index of readings
that you could, you could browse by the, the chapters
and verses of, of the Bible
and everywhere he had referenced, and it's like his grasp
and command of scripture was so, so vast.
Um, but, but, but anyway, it's
Not because of the channeling or
because he, he was just taught and studied scripture.
I think it must be both. But I think he had built his
consciousness in a framework
that was thinking in terms of scripture.
And he had probably a, a very strong memory
of scripture from what I've seen in the documentaries.
He was reading his Bible since he was a kid
and had a very good command of scripture.
But the, the, obviously he was,
he was continuously reinterpreting it, I think,
from his own readings
and, um, piecing things together, which
in incorporated eventually ideas of karma, uh, what,
you know, reaping what you sow and ideas of past lives were.
For some people who were open to that,
he would end up talking about past lives
and how there's specific
blockages, barriers that need to be worked through.
And he would even bring in astrology to some degree.
But, but the, the health information,
the spiritual information, the simple guidance was usually
profound in and of itself without having
to go into any strange corners.
Was, um, was most of his channeling, um,
in sort of a lecture format?
Well, it was a lecture and then a q and a.
It was usually like people came with some general seeking,
and then he would, he would do a kind of lecture on
that seeking like, here we have the subject, the subject is
going through this, the subject has gone through this
and need to, needs to think about this.
It might be benefited by this.
It's kind of like a doctor giving a,
a prognosis or something.
A a a overall treatment plan
would, would be included in that.
And it's like a meta physician.
Yeah. But he would literally prescribe, uh, specific
tinctures and things that they would, they could find,
and he would know where, what stores they could go to
to go find those, those things.
Um, so that they, you know, if something that was local
to them, he would, he would recommend that.
Um,
So, So,
Sorry. Um,
wow, that's fascinating.
So he was, it was not just a,
not just meta physician, but also
It was mi Mindbody spirit.
He saw the whole thing integrated.
Wow. That's beautiful.
So what other, um,
before we get into, I do want to ask you a few questions,
um, around the law of ones, since that's the one that, um,
seemed to grab so much of your attention.
But help us understand what the rest of
that picture looks like.
I mean, how many other pieces have you pulled in, uh,
in your, you know, you're seeking
to understand a greater picture
Since I discovered the law of one?
Uh, no, I mean, just in your,
in your overall journey in terms
of other wisdom traditions or religions.
I know that you've, um, certainly spent more understanding,
uh, things outta the east than I have, that's for sure.
Um, which still blows me away.
It's like, I think you've done enough seeking, you know,
for three or four lifetimes for a lot of people.
But, um, it makes, it makes being a, a, a
spiritual seeking friend of yours.
Uh, wonderful. But, um, yeah.
How did you encounter, um, any other traditions that were,
um, outside of what we talked about
so far in the channel material?
Well, I mean, I, it, it's been little bits here
and there where I come across, um,
people very reverent with the Dao.
For example, the,
the Dao ditching had had a Im impact on me.
And the Buddhist teachings were more easily approachable
by listening to people like Alan Watts.
And I'm sure I, I've studied, uh, other, other teachers
and the, the Hindu side of things, certainly with MDOs,
it was incredible doorway into, into appreciating, like,
I don't know how I would've, um, I,
so I went from laughing at the idea of,
of Hindu gods when I was in college.
I remember having a friend who was, um, Indian,
and he had like a picture of, um,
I think it was, um,
and I remember thinking, oh, that's so silly.
And now it's like everything's come back around
and it's like, oh, that's not silly at all.
That's totally what I'm sure ets look like.
And, but, but the, um, the actual principles are,
are buried a little bit deeper
and some of the, the Hindu, um, texts,
but they're pulled out by certain Hindu teachers, like, um,
Raman Maharshi and, um, certainly named,
named Crowley Baba has been a huge, huge influence.
And that's just increased the way I feel connected
to being Crowley Baba.
Um, and since 2017, I feel a strong pull
to Raman Maharshi's teachings too.
And Raman Maharshi just had so many
interesting ways of looking at the nature of self
and identity that were ultimately pulling us back into the
one truth of the one supreme identity,
which is above and beyond all.
And hi, his grasp of that in a way
that he could verbalize was, was very profound.
And it almost seems like other teachers reached that state,
didn't, didn't risk as much by using as many
words to, to describe that as, as Raman Maharshi did,
because it's probably easy to misinterpret what he's saying.
And eventually people started to focus on, you know,
some people have talked about Raman Harshi talks about there
being a, a point in the body where the, where the eye is,
the eye thought is coming from.
Uh, but now of course, I'm appreciating the
kundalini as having more to do with that.
If you're gonna think about there's a position
where you are, but that's not really related.
We're, we're beyond all space and time.
It's just that we're, we're tracing ourself back to
that which feels like it is in space and time,
and then transcending that.
But that's, you know,
getting off on a tangent from the core teaching,
which is basically just, who am I?
Is his core teaching asking the question, who am I?
And figuring out where that leads, where,
where does that question lead?
And what, what is this I that we are presuming is a,
is a thing that, that, that has a nature, that has a thought
that we're somehow applying to something
that's more real than just the thought is the thought, real
is a thought like a, just a wisp of, of wind
when we think of I, and so he,
so he had a very central kind of way, way
of keeping people on focus, pursuit of that, I thought.
But, um, ne k Baba took a different approach, I think,
and teaching people that they need to really focus on the,
the things that are holding them
back from love and forgiveness.
And I think that that's, that's maybe more of a
important prerequisite for doing the deeper work,
because when we're very attached to aspects
of ourself which are projected outward, um,
then we can't really understand ourself.
Totally. So the forgiveness work has to be done,
the acceptance, self-knowledge,
self-acceptance, become the creator.
And that's the process. And the, I thought quest
to me is partly the becoming the creator part, part, part
of the discipline of the personality that raw speaks of.
Um, but becoming the creator is not necessarily the same
thing as recognizing the self as the creator.
These are, these are two
different ways of looking at the same thing.
And, um, there, you know,
these thoughts ultimately are just kind of converging around
the, the source thought, which would,
could be called the original thought.
I think, um, in the law of one terminology, um, the thought
of, of self exploring in love the creation
through many manifest forms.
Yeah. Um, well, we talk about identity a lot,
and I couldn't agree more that I think ultimately that
that's sort of the core, um, the core
of any true teaching ultimately is to teach us, um,
that we've claimed an identity that is not accurate.
And we do it in a lot of way a million ways, right?
Like we, we carry a lot of labels and identities
and ways of knowing the self, including our thoughts.
To your point, sometimes we think that we are our thoughts
as opposed to the one that's sort of conceiving them
and evaluating them.
Um, so let's talk a little bit about the law of one then.
So I would like to know kind of, you know, in your words,
given that, you know, you expose yourself to, um, uh,
a good number of, of different traditions and,
and sources of information, uh, what is it about the law
of one that that resonates?
Uh, so, so much for you?
Every word on the page, It's,
it's, it's feels like I'm being sucked into, uh,
a very loving, peaceful consciousness that is
compassionate enough to know how I'm,
I can be receiving information
and compassionate enough to help me work
through my issues without pushing something too strongly.
They're very careful about how they deliver information such
that it's not, it's not ever harsh,
although that makes it confusing
because they're so cautious
with the way they're phrasing things.
They don't want to push anyone to thinking something
prematurely or in the wrong way.
Um, and our, our many times in the material they say that,
you know, our, our language is, is not overs strewn
with non-emotional concepts
to represent certain concepts like the astral forms.
And there's so many things that are so hard to describe
because our own language is so limited,
but to the degree that our language can be used,
they used it to, I think it's maximum efficiency and,
and it's like, it's an anchor that draws us back into that,
that density of, of consciousness, which is
more purely aware of the oneness of all polarities,
of all seeking.
So you've, um,
you obviously find resonance in the answers.
Do you find relatability, um, to don in his line
of questioning and or is it, is it a mixed bag sometimes?
You know, like, yeah, you,
because there's two different things going on there.
Yeah. I love Don so much.
I feel like I, like I'm a part
of me is Don a part of, Don is me.
I'm just like merging with Don at, at some level.
It's like his path of seeking felt like mine to some degree.
He just wanted to know the truth.
He was pursuing everything he could with ufology.
And when that led to realization that they want to talk
to us, they want to, they have things to say,
and they're already, they've already been talking to people
and trying to get this information through, then it's like,
of course that's what I wanna know.
I wanna know all about what they want us to know.
And you know, they, they,
they know more than anyone walking around here.
So let's, let's get to the bottom of it.
Well, that's a, that's a great segue
'cause I had on my list here.
Um, if you could, uh,
if you could ask raw three questions, uh, what would they be?
And if you're too on the spot, don't, you know,
don't come up with ones that you know wouldn't be pertinent.
But if you could ask a burning question, what would you,
what would you wanna ask?
Well, I think you might be able to guess it right now now
because of our own pursuits,
but the burning question right now is
can you give us some more examples of
how one might use the other archetypes and,
and what conditions in which one might apply the other major
arana archetypes in one's personal seeking,
and what, what points in time that would be
Hugely powerful and for, for those watching
that may not be as familiar with the material, um, raw does,
uh, provide exactly one, um, perfectly good example, right?
It's just a single one I think of this is how, you know,
this archetype would be used, and it makes perfect sense.
It's, the English is great.
There's no, no esoteric or obscure language or anything.
It's like a perfect, um, explanation.
And when you dive in
and start studying these archetypes, you start to understand
that they're so multifaceted
that you can't simply just extrapolate even to archetypes
of the same kind, but of a different complex.
It's not even necessarily the same.
But, um, yeah, I, I would, uh, highly agree with you.
That would be fantastic if they could have
provided the other 21, uh, examples. Um, and
That, that one example that they did provide is still like
the most useful that, um,
And I use it regularly actually in the exact, you know,
terms that they delivered in.
And I'm like reminding myself like, oh yeah,
this is the new mind, this is the, you know, un yeah.
What is it? The virgin mind, right?
Like sort of un Yeah. Untouched by biases.
I, I feel like I might as well read it to people
because we're sure, um, oh,
they did not categorize it properly on this website.
I will, I will do a search for the exact phrase.
You can search for the phrase new mind. Yep.
So the question was, how is the knowledge of the facets
of the archetypical mind used by the individual
to accelerate his evolution?
And they said, I am raw.
We shall offer an example based upon the first explored
archetype or concept complex.
And that archetype or concept
complex was called the magician.
And it's called the matrix of the Spirit.
And it's called consciousness,
Uh, matrix of the mind.
Matrix of the mind. Yeah.
So the conscious, the conscious mind
of the adept may be full to bursting of the most obstru
and unmanageable of ideas, so
that further ideation becomes impossible.
And work in blue or blue blu-ray
or indigo is blocked through overactivation.
It is then when the, when the mind is bursting
of unmanageable ideas, it is then
that the add upt would call upon the new mind untouched
and virgin and dwell within the archetype of the new
and unblemished mind without bias, without polarity full
of the magic of the logos.
And so they give a little hint at the end there,
why this is the magician.
This is full of the magic of the logos, to be able to
separate yourself from all attachments, come back
to the place of centered stillness
and from that place seek.
All right. Um, do you have a,
a second question that you would ask for?
I guess I feel like there could have been more clarity on
the relationship between mind and spirit and the shuttle.
Um, the nature of the shuttle of consciousness
and the nature of the, like, w why is LSD,
for example, that they use opening a hole
or gateway that is unpredictable?
How is it that LSD
or psychedelics would open up that in a unhelpful way
or potentially less ma manageable way, um,
less consistently usable way?
And what is this, um, process of opening up the spirit?
What is, what is the nature of that?
Um, it's, that's, it's probably way beyond words,
but that's something you can intuitively get a sense of,
I think, when you're starting to have experiences
where you're touching on the connection
to the intelligent affinity or infinite spirit.
But it's a, it's a big question mark
For sure. I would, I
would agree with you though,
that on a psychedelic, um, it would sort of stand to reason
that if the veil is pulled back in a much more substantial
way than what your psyche might, you know,
typically be accepting of, um, you know, it can be a,
an extreme experience, very, very powerful
and, uh, profound,
but not one perhaps that your mind would create
of its own accord, or at least maybe not pull
the veil back quite so much just
because it is, you know, it's a,
it's very impactful experience.
Um, any, uh, anything else that, uh, I mean,
o obviously archetypes one was, um, was huge
and that would give us a couple years worth of content for
the deep back to go into that.
But, um, anything else that, uh,
before we move on that you'd like to ask Ryan?
I suppose it would, it would seem fair
because there's such a huge amount of controversy
and divide that if, if they could narrow down a little bit,
narrow down the nature of the transition period
and how the transition period
to fourth density relates to harvest.
Yeah. Does the harvest happen over the transition period,
or is it at one point in time?
That's a huge question.
Sure. And I have, you know, thoughts on that,
but they're less relevant
because really, you're right, it does, it is sort
of left open to, uh, some level
of conjecture and speculation.
Um, lastly, have you ever encountered, um, any people, uh,
person or opportunity, uh, in which you considered
that you might have, uh, a chance to, um,
to, uh, work either with RAW
or any other channeled entity, um, either
through your own capabilities or capacity
or somebody that you've, you've known, has it ever occurred
to you to, you know, like, would Mike, um, you know,
fit into a, a similar, uh, group just like Don and Carla
and Jim did to, you know, to pull something like this off
and actually ask these kind of questions of raw?
Yeah, I definitely thought about that.
And different people do make me think of that.
And, and eventually those people make me think,
okay, maybe it wouldn't work.
It's like there's just, everyone has their own baggage
and challenges in life, and even Don and Carla
and Jim, they were struggling to, you know,
find a suitable location where Don didn't have, Don had to,
you know, go off and be an airline pilot.
He couldn't just do that work. There was no,
this world is not built to support this kind of seeking,
and it's mysterious how that is. It's like,
It would be with free energy potentially.
I mean, Ben Raw, um, allude to that, that some
of the technologies that were delivered
through the Industrial Revolution were
ultimately geared toward just creating more time
for people to seek.
Yeah, yeah. More time in the evenings, more time,
uh, with, with lights.
Yeah. So you can actually see
And read. Yeah.
Yeah. Um, that's,
That's a question for another time in
private, I think, to go into that.
Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Um, I'd love to, uh, to hear more.
Um, okay.
So, uh, we've touched on medicines a little bit,
and so I would like to, um, you know, if, if seeking,
uh, through spiritual text is, is digital, I guess
for me anyway, the way that I see this,
a psychedelic experience is sort of the analog, um, uh, in,
in spiritual experience.
So, um, how has, uh, how has this looked for you?
Um, what part have psychedelics played, you know, kind of
how would you characterize them
and, um, you know, what were some
of the more poignant experiences?
Well, definitely the most significant experience would've
been when I first opened up to LSD
and took a 300 microgram dose sitting in a pyramid.
Most of the day I was in the pyramid,
and I feel like the pyramid was like a protective mechanism.
It was 12
and a half, uh, foot at the base,
eight foot high copper pipes.
And I made, I did that so that my head would be
around the king's chamber position.
And I felt that was very,
very peaceful healing space to be in.
And what I, well, that's, there's
so many aspects to that story.
I could, I guess the most significant thing of that day
was a, a kind of feeling that I did not know who I was
and the vision that I was sort of falling behind with my
selfish pursuits
and the, the role in which I had incarnated to necessitated
that I walk hand in hand with those brothers of light
that were beside me and, and catch back up
and maintain that hand to hand.
Like it was like a line that I, that I saw of, uh,
of beings like myself that were holding hands
and walking forward through the galaxy, through the cosmos
to do the work of bringing the healing that's needed.
And unless we're working together,
we're not really doing that healing work.
So it was, it was almost as though I was
separating from the sense that I didn't have the purpose
that I, I knew I had come for, um,
and the sense of distractions that the ego can lead to
where are painfully apparent
after that experience that I, but,
and it felt like I was having to re clothe myself
with a personality afterward that I didn't like.
I didn't want that personality again,
but I still had worked through it
because this is somehow
what I've allowed myself to be stuck with.
And so I'll just keep chipping away at the distortions
of the personality as I seek to become more purified.
Um, that was the first experience. Um,
And has LSD been sort of, um, you know, in that, uh, role
or, or, um, you know, have you had
that a similar relationship to it?
Uh, since
I've never had anything quite like that with LSD, um,
but everything is a reminder of the, um, the,
the, the need to stay vigilant against the distortions
of the ego and the temptations of self-aggrandizement
and all that junk.
And, um, I think that
I've been greatly benefited by MDMA
to assist me in my seeking
because the, the distractions that come up
with intense psychedelics can be, I feel like they can be,
um, work with more comfortably
with added assistance.
And, and certainly GoTo Cola is the number one thing
that's helped me, which is not illegal.
So GoTo Cola is the plant medicine that I recommend
to everyone that's been the most beneficial
GOTU space, KOLA.
And I find that that is the one that,
it's not like blowing open the veil,
but it's, it's cracking the door open just enough that I,
that when I'm seeking in some way to worship the creator
to be more connected,
then the reverence comes more naturally,
the sacredness comes more obviously apparent.
And, and I can, I can work from a higher state
more consistently with that.
Um, but, uh, yeah, certainly MDMA
and certainly my wife has been the biggest sort of catalyst
to help me break through a lot of issues.
And so having the MDMA with her
was one of the most healing things, um, for both of us.
Um, and so I certainly hope that one can become legalized.
I know it's going through like
FDA testing or something right now.
Hopefully that can be completed. Sure.
And people can actually use that on,
maybe on a more similar level to the way they use ketamine,
where they can, um, go somewhere
to have a good treatment plan
and not just use it recreationally,
although that obviously is helpful.
Um,
But perhaps for more acute circumstances, PTSD,
things like that, there's probably some benefit
to a clinical approach.
Yeah. Um, what about DMT?
Where do you, uh, what does DMT fall
in with all these things?
Well, there was a time when I decided I really needed
to try experiencing this DMT dimension
thing everyone was talking about.
So I bought some Chaga, um, off the dark net, which was 50,
uh, variety of herbs with mixed with DMT.
And that was pretty easy to smoke in a bong
and get a pretty good hit.
And, uh, that's the hardest thing
with DMT is getting a very large amount in your lungs.
You kinda have to have some practice getting
through some pain experience with your lungs.
And, but I was ready. I I, I got a very, very large dose.
And the first time I did it, I was able to
go out a body break through into this other place.
And it was like the,
the curtains kind of started to open
and it was like brighter, more vivid light,
more colors than anything I'd seen with my physical eyes.
And that was completely shocking.
At first, it was like a TV was turning on,
but then I realized this is way more vivid than anything
I've ever seen on any kind of television show.
This is not like a,
um, anything I could describe easily.
And, but then after the curtains opened,
and it was almost like there was two serpent figures,
and then I, I was like, what is this?
And then it was like, I looked up
and then I just shot out like a rocket into
some other space, which was like an astral plane
or something where I, I felt that it was,
I could see everything around me.
It was kind of like on some level, like a jungle
where there was a wildness to it.
And at some level, it's like a bustling city where there's,
but I was in the middle of a city too, um,
Colorado Springs when I, when I had this experience.
So it would make sense if there was some feeling
of city energy around me, but,
but it was like I could look out and see all kinds of forms
and figures in this other plane, and it was extremely dense
and it was extremely full of light and energy.
And there were a few figures that were present
that were all feminine, that were
sort of wanting my attention.
Um, but I initially said, I want the highest light,
I want the highest experience that I can.
And so I, I kind of looked up
and I felt what felt like heavenly realms, like
beyond description, feeling of sacredness
and a feeling of peace, um,
and in, in some higher planes.
And then, uh, I kind of dropped back down pretty quickly
and got distracted again by these, these figures in front
of me that were wanting my attention.
Of course, when I first broke through, it was like,
there were like dozens
of these entities wanting my attention that were like,
I would, I would call 'em lower astral entities
because that's just what makes sense now that they were kind
of at, like, at the bottom of this blast off experience.
And they were all kind of reaching out,
trying to get my attention.
And I, like, I didn't care about them.
And so I just broke through all of them.
And then there were the, these higher entities
that were seemingly more sophisticated in
how they were trying to interact with me.
And they were, I was trying
to figure out what their agenda was.
And um, one of them in particular, um, I started
to worry is this, is this secretly some kind
of demonic thing trying to get my attention.
And then that snapped me out of it,
and then I lost everything back down to my body.
Um, so I can't say for sure what that was,
but I feel like the, the nature of there being
temptations being offered
by astral entities was a much more clear
concept to me after that.
On that DT is, is interaction with other entities,
um, in and of itself a little bit more typical
for you on a psychedelic,
or is that, um, more, um, A DMT specific experience?
I don't know how to answer that necessarily.
I feel like I always assume that there's some guides
that are interacting with me,
but I'm sort of more interested on the lesson
and I'm just happy to, to see the, the best lesson
that they're trying to show me without,
without it becoming about, about a dialogue as much as it is
like, uh, like a
What, what the message is not focused on the meta,
but what yeah.
What the real lesson that's available in
that time and space is.
Yep. Yeah.
And making sure I'm communicating
with the right entities is not very hard when I'm, when I,
when you do the proper work upfront, the, the proper, um,
preparations and prayers and clearings and,
and then when your heart is in the right space,
it's very obvious what you're dealing with
has your best interest in mind.
Yeah. And I can't recommend that
to people enough when they're, you know, starting
to do almost any work in consciousness that, that that, uh,
intention and and alignment
and you know, what you carry into a space
and what you claim will be your experience is
what your experience will be.
And so it's real helpful to, um, to claim that,
you know, in a real high alignment.
And, um,
and then, yeah, I think you set yourself up for success.
Um, anything else that you would, um, that you would, um,
you know, I had this, uh, question I wanted
to ask if you could design a a a spiritual retreat,
and this is things I'm sure that we've even talked about
before, 'cause a lot of people think about this,
but if you were to, um, you know, to have your druthers,
what would a, a spiritual retreat, uh, for you look like?
Oh, it's, it's, it's such an exciting concept.
Um, I've, I've been wanting to have something that as a more
reverent, sacred vibe to it
for a long time, a dedicated space.
Um, I certainly want there to be pyramids for people to use.
And it doesn't have to be anything too big or fancy,
but just being able to be in pyramids
oriented towards either north
or 20 degrees east of north is a huge benefit.
Um, and certainly
religious symbols can be helpful for people.
Candles can be helpful, incense can be helpful.
Everyone's a little different though, so it's like,
I can't just say what I would like would necessarily be the
way to build a center.
It's like, I could build my own room
that would be perfect for me. And
I think each retreat honestly ends up looking
and feeling a little different based on the, the collective
that aggregates in that time and space.
So, so yeah, if you were to design a center that would,
you know, probably look one way or,
or be a little bit more broadly applicable to, um,
more people for more walks of life, I suppose.
But, um, yeah, if, if you were to host a, a retreat
or have, um, some of your, you know, closest
spiritual seeking friends at a retreat,
but it sounds like pyramids, uh, definitely there, uh,
religious, uh, and spiritual symbology.
Um, definitely present. Yeah. Um, what about, um, music?
What, uh, what sort of musical vibe would you
Lean towards that is so, uh, dependent on people too.
I mean, I, I get so much out of even old hymns, just
gentle, gentle self music,
but I still get along contemporary Christian worship too.
But, um, certainly
that can even be its own trip when you're focusing on the
lyrics versus allowing yourself to sort of sound your,
silence your mind even more than that, which was certain,
obviously, uh, ambient kinda music can be very helpful.
And there's so, so much of that.
And a part of me, a part of me still wants to like explore,
like, are there certain chord transitions, uh, and you
and mu music theory where you could have certain transitions
just continuously, um, go up the scales,
up the octaves gently.
Maybe there are some types of music I wanna explore,
but that's like a, that's such a long, uh, it take,
it takes a lot of time to make music.
So I don't know if I can get into that, but that's,
Oh man. No, I
agree. But I'm also fascinated by that and somatics
and solfeggio frequencies
and the, the notion of a different musical scale, right?
Which again, something for another day
that we could dive into and just try to figure out that,
you know, particular conspiracy theory in
and of itself is just fascinating to think about that. Um,
Oh, you mean the, the Hertz, the the
Four, yeah. The four
40 versus the 4 32 and it's like, yeah. And
I'm actually, Most people that have never encountered
that would've no idea what that even Yeah.
Means or is a thing. And it's
Fascinating. I, I was
strongly, uh, influenced by an article
that I found talking about 4 32 is also, uh,
disinformation folks trying to pull us away from 4 44,
which is the real, because there was like, um, the,
there's like the, the, the one of the frequencies
that shows up when you're using 4 44 tuning for middle C
is like the 5 32
that people know is associated with the heart.
And it just shows up naturally in that scale. Okay.
Um, whereas it doesn't show up naturally in four 40 or 4 32.
Um, but, but 4 44 is what people even like the Beatles.
It's like what people are naturally tuning their instruments
just to their ear, like in an orchestra,
they may naturally tune it up a little bit.
They don't turn it down a little bit, they tune it up a
little bit to make it a little bit nicer sounding
Interesting. So I've
tried experimenting with converting songs
to be 4 44 and it's athe very nice experience really
to tweak 'em up, up just a little bit.
I didn't know that was even a thing.
Well, definitely something for another, uh, another time.
I'd love to dive into that though.
We could do a call just about that.
I know, uh, Nick would have, um, a lot to offer too.
He is got a musical background too, as I recall.
But, um, otherwise, Mike, I just
so appreciate, um, this today.
Is there anything else that you'd like to, um, to kind
of add in terms of your path and what's next?
And, um, I really appreciate you helping us understand kind
of what, what's gotten you to, uh, to this point.
But if there's anything in the near future that you know,
you're warming up to get excited about, I'd love to hear it.
Well, I'm certainly now, now
that I've moved out into the mountains,
I'm certainly excited to learn, you know, the, the best way
to meditate in nature with others.
And I'm partly, I know it's a long drive to get
where I'm right now, but I'm partly excited to see if there,
there is a, a, a way
to get more people meditating in nature in some structured
way without needing to talk to each other, just,
just enough to get where they need to be.
I, I know that there's added benefit in speaking
and seeking together, even if you're seeking inwardly,
somehow when we're connected with other people
and we're meditating together,
that can be somehow exponentially more profound.
And it's almost like there's an automatic connection without
even there having to be any external clues.
It's just people are going in together,
it's somehow the energy starts to connect
and we're all connected.
So doing that in nature also I think connects us to
the trees that are already meditating
around us on some level.
And it's like we're becoming more united
with the greater consciousness, which is seeking peace,
which is Mother Gaia expressing itself through the,
the nature around us
and the, the, just the natural state of being that,
that we're all kind of trying to seek
to return to. For sure.
I would, I would be a yes for that for sure.
As soon as you're ready to, uh, to coordinate
that you can count me in
and, um, yes, I will definitely echo what Valerie says
and express immense gratitude to you, uh, on behalf
of a number of communities
and a lot of people that, um,
that I know you're doing just amazing work for,
to pull people together
and disseminate, um, these beautiful messages
that you've learned from all these, um, interesting sources.
So, um, thank you for everything that you do, Mike,
and thanks for your time today as well.
Thank you. And thank you for taking on this role
of interviewer
and I'm sure you could do this much more if you wanted to.
You, you structured it very well.
Oh, thanks. It'd be my pleasure.
Mm-Hmm. Alright.
I guess I could say bye to recording right now
and say hello to the people who are attending.
Sounds good.